IN THE SHORT period of time that I have known the Swedish Ambassador to Malaysia, Joachim Bergström, and his team at the embassy, I have been struck by their unanimous and unwavering commitment to their Swedish values: egalitarianism, inclusivity and a deep, personal obligation to environmental sustainability. In events held by the embassy that I have attended, I witnessed high-ranking officials opting to walk to locations instead of taking the car—talk about walking the talk. As his tenure comes to an end, Penang Monthly sits down with the ambassador to talk about his team’s efforts in introducing these universal values to the country, and how these can strengthen the bilateral relationship between Sweden and Malaysia.

Sheryl Teoh: So, there will be a big turnover in the embassy these coming few months. You’re leaving soon, Emma from Business Sweden is leaving and the interns too, who have been so much a part of your organising team.

Joachim Bergström: Well, my posting here was for three years and the interns are usually here for six months at a time, but it is a little sad that we are all leaving at the same time.

ST: I have attended several events organised by the embassy by now, and I have always been struck by how closely it works with Business Sweden; and in such a public and manifest way. I mean, you even call yourself Team Sweden—it’s an inspiring show of unity and cooperation.

JB: I think we worked really hard at integration because we work on so many of the same issues—green transition, digitalisation and innovation are our three main pillars. Business Sweden works with these values from a business point of view, and we work with them from a policy and bilateral angle; from the embassy side, we want to stimulate a lot of exchanges and dialogues on these different issues.

So, I think we have worked really hard at finding ways to synergise, and it has been so beneficial. Because of this, we’ve been able to pool our resources— almost as if we’re a joint venture. And we have regular joint planning days where we catch up and strategise together.

ST: You are also one of the ambassadors who are more active in the Malaysian public consciousness. You’ve initiated a lot of programmes—the WikiGap edit-a-thon and “Jom Kita Bincang” are two that come to mind. Is that something your predecessors have done? Or is it just your own initiative?

JB: We are given a broad mission when we take up the role of an ambassador. First and foremost is, of course, to nurture and cultivate the bilateral relationship between Malaysia and Sweden as much as we can. This obviously encompasses trade and investment—the business community and the business interests of both countries—but it also encompasses multilateral and bilateral dialogues.

We want to work with Malaysia where it’s possible within the UN system, we want to support Malaysia’s growth in ASEAN. We also closely follow Malaysia’s dialogue within the Organisation of Islamic Cooperation (OIC), and we invite Malaysia to be a good partner for Europe as part of the ASEAN-Europe relationship.

But apart from that, I think we are given a very important opportunity to create a real bond between the two countries. And I think one of the ways we’ve done that is through programmes that circle around the issues we care about: sustainability, digitalisation, the green transition and innovation. To this end, we’ve tried to bring actors together regularly in workshops and symposiums, and also integrate journalists, civil society and government stakeholders.

Another important part of our work, I think, is promoting Swedish culture in the country. I’ve tried to work through cinema and literature—I believe that you can give people a lot of facts and information, but the way people remember is from making some kind of emotional connection with the place—through food, music, art and design. We’ve tried to showcase the Swedish lifestyle— especially where sustainability is concerned. But I’ve always said that the real ambassadors of Sweden in Malaysia are the Swedes who are living here and the Swedes who visit.

ST: You mentioned trying to stimulate more trade both ways. What are some obstacles you have faced in that sense?

JB: We have about 100 companies that are already present here that have been here for a long time and are making good development. The business climate here is good for the Swedish industries: there’s stable political landscape, the lifestyle and quality of life here is very good, English is spoken everywhere… There are also good incentives in terms of investments, tax cuts and so forth. In my short time here, I’ve been to so many openings. So, I think there’s good motion in the bilateral relationship when it comes to trade and investment.

Maybe one obstacle that I can think of is that, for some reason, Malaysia is under-known in Sweden. I think people know a lot about Thailand and Singapore—there is a very strong connection between Sweden and Singapore when it comes to innovation and green transition. But Malaysia is not as known as I feel it should be. I think there is also a lot of focus in Europe on Southeast Asian countries like Cambodia, Vietnam and Indonesia as investment destinations, but I think Malaysia has a lot to offer.

ST: How do you think Malaysia can push itself to be more known in Sweden?

JB: Telling success stories to Swedish companies and the business community there. For example, the other day, I attended the opening of a Sandvik factory in Negeri Sembilan. They had just set up operations in Malaysia and they’re making mining equipment for the Asia-Pacific region. Malaysia won the competition between other countries that were in the bid—I think sharing these kinds of success stories with the broader business community in Sweden would be a very strong push for companies that are looking to expand into the region. I think Malaysia is also a very good stepping stone to the rest of the ASEAN countries.

ST: Sweden is world-renowned for its commitment to environmental sustainability. When Swedish companies set up business here in Malaysia, do they also impose the same strict standards for sustainability on their local partners and counterparts?

JB: I think many Swedish companies led the green transition not because it’s a good thing to do, but because it’s the economically viable thing to do in the long term. In fact, many Swedish companies have actually taken on harsher restrictions and higher benchmarks than what the public policy says because that is how to stay in business and that’s also how many of them operate here—sourcing ethically, making sure that the supply chains are also operating in the most sustainable way, not only in terms of the green transition, but the whole 17 sets of sustainable development goals…

We (Team Sweden) together with the business community and local stakeholders here have remained in constant conversation about sustainability best practices, small changes that you can do in your operations to “go green”, how to digitalise your business, how the green shift is also driving innovation and so on.

Malaysia, I feel, has very good awareness around sustainability; the discourse is there. But, some steps remain to be taken, both when it comes to individuals—how they live their lives—and when it comes to the business communities. And I think Sweden will remain a very strong partner to Malaysia in knowledge sharing and support in this sense.

ST: You’ve been to Penang several times now, and Penang touts itself as a sustainable city. Do you think that we are there yet? And if not, what are our areas of improvement?

JB: [laughs] I’m not an expert on Penang, but I think public transportation and connectivity jump out as areas where improvement is needed. I think Penang has a lot to offer—not only in its richness in cultural, food and architectural heritage, but also in biodiversity. But having all these better connected can definitely make a difference. And, I suppose the broader ecosystem of the industries here, and how they could work in more integrated ways to reduce energy consumption and find ways to be more sustainable would be a good start.

ST: What are some lessons Penang can apply, in the local context, from what Sweden is doing in terms of sustainability?

JB: In the beginning of our sustainability journey, a lot of things that we have been able to change, in terms of how we do business as well as social development and social construction, has been top-down and political. But, there has always been a very strong, bottom-up approach as well from civil society, from education, from the cultural sphere… And I think that is also present in Penang.

I sense that there is a very strong awareness for environmental sustainability in the civil society, in the cultural actors and in the education sector in Penang, and I hope that these actors also feel that they have the agency, the credibility and the possibility to participate in conversations about the steps that Penang needs to take to be more sustainable. And of course, like I said, it takes both top-down political will and bottom-up public support for policy-driven transformations to happen.

Close integration with academia is also important—to always integrate academic research and innovation with social realities so that they are aware of the needs of the communities.

And then, the fourth pillar is, of course, the business community. And how they—even when they are foreign companies—can be part of a living and energetic ecosystem. There should be close and frequent dialogues among all these different stakeholders about the environmental impact of what they are doing, and also about the sustainable and responsible development of Penang.

This requires a lot of knowledge sharing, it requires—in a huge part— humility: when you go into these conversations, you need to be actually willing to learn and listen and change. There will be high initial costs, but I believe that eventually, and in the long term, this will be the most economic way to do business.

ST: The “Jom Kita Bincang” initiative that you started, which explores how children’s literature can be used to educate children on sustainability, health and social issues—it’s been well-received and successful, all things considered. Will it be continued by your successor?

JB: I hope so, and I hope that this will become a global thing. The idea of “Jom Kita Bincang” is to use the treasure trove of resources which already exists, which are children’s books—and they can be from any country and of any language—and extract from them seeds for conversation on sustainability, human rights and social issues, better health, etc. After all, real transformation happens only when the young are exposed early in their lives to these topics.

And again, the whole idea of “Bincang” also goes back to what I said about making an emotional connection to something in order to remember it. And this is where the programme has been so transformational, because we read books together with the children, we talk about what it means to us—took issue with some of the content, discarded a few ideas, but also embraced what felt right—and then we make crafts together to really metabolise the message of the book. And so, this whole idea of using children’s books to inspire conversations, I hope will not only continue with stakeholders, partners and friends in Malaysia, but also spread to the Swedish Embassies in other countries like Latin America, Africa, the US and Europe. Sustainability, human rights, health, equality—these are universal values, after all.

This is another thing—you know, I don’t believe that there are “European” or “Asian” values.

I believe that these are universal values. And I take issue sometimes when well-meaning European politicians tout European values, and I think it triggers a negative response in other parts of the world because of the colonial legacy. There is an East-West divide, a North-South divide. I believe that the right to dignity, the right to justice, the right to education, to livelihood, the right to take care of the planet for future generations… these are not Western, Eastern, Northern or Southern values. They are universal, and we need to fight for these issues in their universality. And if teaching these values can contribute to a shift in young people, then I’m all for it.

ST: How did you come up with the idea for “Jom Kita Bincang”? When did you start seeing the need for it?

I think, throughout my time here, I have been struggling a little bit with how to make an impact in Malaysia when it comes to… again, getting into conversations about who we are and what we believe in.

And so, when I went around in Malaysia and met with ministers, religious leaders and politicians, with academics and journalists and so forth, I wanted to listen and learn a lot from them, and I wanted to ask them how they perceive Sweden. What they said didn’t completely match with what my idea of my country was and wasn’t.

And one of the things I usually do when I meet these people is to ask them: “If you were me, if you were the Swedish ambassador in Malaysia, how would you approach the task of getting Malaysians to be more aware of the richness and complexities of Sweden?”

The advice that I got were:

1. Work closely with local partners: universities, the media, civil society, politicians, royals… Anyone who can be allies in promoting your country;

2. Create strong institutional bonds;

3. Change the conversation: If the conversation about your country is not what you are about, you can always step in and try to change the conversation;

4. Go back to your key values. What do you believe in? What are you willing to die for? What are the values that you think are driving this society?;

5. Work closely with the media, be generous with them and form strong relationships with them so you can also learn from them in conversations;

6. Go beyond KL. If you want to make an impact in Malaysia, you cannot stay solely in the Klang Valley.

In 2022, the IBBY International Children’s Book conference was also held here in Malaysia, and a few of the actors and main stakeholders in the Swedish literature scene came. That gave us an opportunity to make strong connections with Malaysians and Swedes working in this space.

As for the themes that unfolded out of “Jom Kita Bincang”—these are straightforward because they are the core of everything we work on here. Like I mentioned, every conversation within Team Sweden is about planetary health, living more ethically with nature, supporting human rights, upholding democratic principles… If we don’t have human rights, there is no democracy; and if there is no democracy, human rights will always struggle—it is a never-ending cycle.

What naturally comes up then is also the connection between literacy and democracy. If kids cannot read, or if adults cannot read and process information, then democracy—which really relies on the informed decisions of citizens—will be compromised. So, within my team—and it is a huge team effort—“Bincang” came about very organically; a chain of events that led one thing to another.

The name “Jom Kita Bincang” is deliberate. It’s like the bincang that we’re doing now: you’re asking me questions and I’m trying to answer you as best I can—it’s a conversation. So, we’re hoping to convey the fact that we are not coming from Sweden to lecture anyone on what to do, we come with the seeds for conversation, and we want to learn with you and from you. We want to throw this idea out and hear how you react to it. And we want to do something together that you will remember for some time.

In an earlier conversation with the Raja Muda of Selangor, we spoke about doing “Bincang” together. He really enjoyed the idea and suggested using the Raja Tun Uda Library in Selangor as a meeting place and point of attraction for different partners in this programme.

As I was advised, we also took our initiatives to other states in Malaysia, like Kuching, Johor Bahru, Perlis and Penang. And I hope in the future these programmes would also be expanded to places like Kelantan, Terengganu and Pahang… Places where embassies normally don’t do outreach programmes.

ST: And the demographics are so different too in all these states.

JB: Yes, they are. Actually, another thing I hope for is that we move away from hierarchies. At the end of the day, we only have our own bodies and one planet. This is what “Bincang” is also about: to teach children that no matter how rich or poor or educated or disenfranchised we are, we should all have a willingness to learn and work on these universal issues across social, class and educational divides.

ST: Thank you so much for your time, Joachim. I hope you have enjoyed your tenure in Malaysia, and come back for a visit soon.